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Should You Buy a Second-Hand Prius?

Maintenance costs may outstrip fuel savings

By Joe Benton
ConsumerAffairs.com

April 4, 2008

With sales of new hybrids increasing by almost 30 percent a year and gasoline prices following at a faster pace, a second-hand hybrid can appear to be a smart alternative in a tight economy.

But because of the car's relatively new design, there is little information available to help consumers judge the reliability of a used Prius other than reports from previous Prius owners.

Consumer beware. The risks may be higher than you think.

Battery blues

Doris in Smithville, Tennessee bought a used Prius in July 2006.

“Trying to inform myself prior to buying the car, I asked about the battery and was told never had they seen the whole battery fail, only a cell at a time to the tune of $200 per cell,” she was told. “I did not want to spend the money on a brand-new Prius. I wanted to test the waters on a used one first.”

The decision to buy a second had hybrid was costly.

The 2006 Prius had 73,200 miles on the odometer leaving 26,800 remaining on the hybrid battery warranty. “I bought it and thought I was living the dream, but only for a moment,” Doris told ConsumerAffairs.com.

When the weather turned cold her Prius would have no power. The engine was difficult to start. “Finally it went totally down,” she said. “No power!”

The Toyota dealer told Doris at first that she must have over-filled the gas tank and may have ruined the Prius computer system. The repair cost would be $1,900.

One year later the Prius lost all power while driving at 65 mph on an Interstate highway. "I was scared to death,” Doris wrote. The Prius was towed to a dealer and Doris was told “the main battery was down it would be $6,890 to fix it.”

Remember, the first dealer told her the battery never failed completely and the replacement cost would be roughly $2,000.

Doris was lucky as things turned out.

“They called tech support and found it was a leaf sucked up in a filter which in turn prevented gas and air from going to the battery and drained it." Doris spent $225 to tow the Prius to the dealer and $276 to charge the main battery plus tax, a lot less than the original $6,890 repair estimate but still $549.85.

But not all the repair news was good. "They told me it could happen again. So I'm stuck with what I feel is a defective product. I'm Toyota's rolling gunea pig,” she said. “I cannot trade the car because they tell I'm $5,500 up side down," she said. “I have to buy a new car to roll this amount with it. I can't afford a new car with a $425 per month payment.”

Transmission troubles

In Loomis, California, Sam tells the tale of expensive repairs with his 2003 Prius.

After a series of problems with the Prius engine, Toyota informed Sam that he needed to have the transmission replaced. The estimate for repairs was around $7,000, almost the value of the entire vehicle, according to Sam.

“Naturally the vehicle was no longer covered by the warranty,” he said.

The Prius had 116,289 miles on the odometer when the car began to malfunction. The check-engine light came on and the engine quickly shut down. The dealership informed Sam that the gasoline engine quit because the battery ran out of juice. The dealership checked the spark plugs and coils, detected slight misfire until warm but could not reproduce the problem. The cost of the service was $123.77.

The repair bill seemed too good to be true. And it was.

When the problem occurred a second time, the Toyota dealership said that the “problem was not really the spark plugs but that the sophisticated hybrid transmission needed to be replaced. The estimate for the parts and labor for this repair would be approximately $2,000.” The estimate was quickly revised to $7,000 with parts and labor. The “cost of the new transmission alone was $5,000,” Sam reported.

Early adopter

In Sunnyvale, California, Matt was one of the original 2001 Prius hybrid owners.

“Now, after 130,000 miles of driving the main battery is dead. The Toyota dealer is telling me the life of the main battery was 100,000 for my car, although the new Prius comes with a 150,000-mile warranty,” he said.

Matt said that the dealer told him he was the third Prius owner to require a main battery replacement.

“Labor and parts, plus tax was $4,500. Unfortunately, there is no third-party service provider who knows how to fix Prius,” he said.

Matt warns consumers interested in a second hand Prius to be prepared to pay $4,500 for the main battery before 150,000 miles have been recorded on the odometer.”

Complexity

That is not all.

“The car is loaded with electronics and solid state controllers. Be prepared to pay outrageous prices for diagnostics and repair. Very rarely you will walk out with a bill costing under $300,” Matt said.

“You will pay nearly $150 for having a duplicate key made to your Prius. That is because the key apparently has an anti-theft chip which has to be programmed by Toyota,” he said.

There's no doubt the Prius gets good gas mileage (though perhaps not as good as many buyers expect). But whether the total cost of ownership is reasonable is another question indeed.

Consumers who need reliable, inexpensive transportation are still better off with a simple, straightforward economy car -- a Toyota Corolla, Honda Civic or something similar with a four-cylinder engine and a manual transmission are likely to provide trouble-free, economic transportation for hundreds of thousands of miles.

Here are some of the reports we've received from other Prius owners:

Steven of Petersburg VA (06/05/08)
There are a lot of complaints about the Prius I see. I just wanted to give my two cents by saying that my Prius is a GREAT car. I bought it used for 18K in Jan 08 with 80K miles on the odometer. It now has over 100K and I am getting 57mpg city/highway combined. I easly go just under 600 miles on one tank before I have to refill. I would recommend a Prius to anyone (if you can find one) and I cannot wait until the price of the plug-in battery packs comes down. The battery packs are just too expensive right now, but as the price of gas goes up, the battery pack price will come down.

No damage just a great car.

Ginny of Cascade, ID June 3, 2008

Ginny of Cascade ID (06/03/08)
My new 2007 Prius Toyota with 5000 miles on it quit running. Would not start. Called dealer and had maintenance dept. walk me through a jump start as with these cars you do it under the front hood not in the back where the battery is. Car still would not start. They said have it towed in. I did have it towed in the 85 miles to the dealer. After several mis communication calls and two different reports on my car I found out they will not fix under warranty. Say I jumped it wrong. They say I caused the damage and that warranty is only for defective parts. How come the car wouldn't start in the first place? How could I do that much damage anyway? I was very carefull anyway and know red from back and positive from negative. Why did the mechanic walk me through the jump if it had potential to damage the hybrid system. Why didn't he just say to have the car towed in. They want me to pay a minimum of 4800 and maybe the towing which could be thousands more. I bought this car because of the high maintenance rating and know look what a mess I am in.

They want me to pay for the repair and estimate a minimum of 4800. Could be much more. I can not afford a lawyer, and feel they should fix the car under warranty. How do I know it is not a lemon. Have read several articles about these cars just stoping (after I had already purchasedone...all the reviews were flowing on the purchase sites)

Mark of Kingfisher, OK June 2, 2008

Mark of Kingfisher OK (06/02/08)
My wife and I just purchased a 2008 Prius Touring edition from Northcutt Toyota in Enid, Oklahoma. The salesman Jeff Wagner was absolutely the best salesman I have ever had the pleasure to deal with. As for prices of insurance we insured our new Prius through State Farm with 100/300/100 coverage with a 500.00 deductible paying 52.00 a month/624.00 a year. Both of us have a great driving record but I have very poor credit. It is possible that those receiving high insurance rates, such as 1500.00 a year, are receiving that rate because of poor credit, even if they have a great dirving record. Most all insurance companies run credit reports and AllState insurance is one that will charge you more for auto insurance due to poor credit and/or cancel you if its really bad (I know this from experience). I suggest checking with all insurance companies as it is possible to get a decent rate for the Prius, it just takes time to find the right insurance provider.

Darlene of Woodland, WA June 2, 2008

Darlene of Woodland WA (06/02/08)
We just got back from an over 2000 mile road trip. There was an area where we needed a full tank of gas. We stopped to fill up in Ashland Oregon (the gas is pumped for you here) and thought the tank was full. After switching drivers ... not quite 83 miles later ... we were down to four clicks on the fuel gauge!!! Luckily, there was ONE last station before we headed into an area of no gas stations. I filled up and managed to nearly fill the tank. We called our local Toyotal dealer on Tuesday May 26th to report the issue and never received a call back even though I talked to a live person! (This tech noted that this was becoming an issue, even though Toyota was not acknowlodging it!) I did not get a call back ... I called again on Friday after we managed to get home. Mine you, each fill up took extroadnory measures (pulling the pump nosile nearly entirely out of the tank ...) which seems a HUGE safety risk JUST to fill a gas tank! and then filling the tank REALLY REALLY slowly and the letting the AIR bubble out a couple of times ... JUST to get a FULL tank of gas!!!!!!!!! Also on our road trip we ran into another Prius owner at a reststop. He owned a 2005 Prius. We asked if he has any challenges with filling his tank. He did and was told that it had to do with the ambient temprature! I passed on that I was told that there was a bladder and that there were many issues with trying to fill up a Prius. In addition to the fuel gauge NOT working and the average fuel guage NOT working ... long stroy not so short ... the Prius does get reasonable fuel ecomomy (my 1989 Honday civic got 39MPG) this fuel tank, gas guage, average mileage, is a HUGE saftey issue!!! I cannot count on the gas guage to tell me when I am low on gas ... since it takes nearly 200 miles for one tick to tick off ... I cannot count on the average mileage to tell me when to fill up ... I have to look at the miles driven and guess about 40MPG at when to fill up! I tell you ... I have had several Toyotas, but not one where I had NO IDEA as to what or when I needed to fill up!!!!!! !

J.j. of Cranberry Township, PA May 27, 2008

J.j. of Cranberry Township PA (05/27/08)
I am writing concerning some issues with the Toyota sales staff that at some dealerships in western Pennsylvania who have displayed very unprofessional behavior and poorly represented Toyota. My wife and I are contemplating purchasing a Toyota Prius. We have been very excited about this prospect and have been motivated buyers to say the least. On Wednesday May 21, 2008, I made several calls to local Toyota dealerships in Western, PA (Baierl Dealership in Mars, PA, North Hills Dealership, McKnight, PA, and Diehl Toyota in Butler, PA. I asked the sales representatives at Baierl and North Hills about Prius availability and was treated very rudely and told that I would not have any luck at any other dealership. It was obvious that they did not want to sell me a Prius or any other type of car. I then called the Diehl Toyota dealer in Butler, PA. I was thrilled when I spoke to a sales representative named Todd who told me that the dealership had six Prius available and that we could test drive one. On Saturday May 24, 2008, my wife and I went to Diehl Toyota and an employee approached us and asked us if he could help. We told him that we wished to test drive a Prius and he told us that the dealership did not have any available. I was confused and told him that I spoke to Todd and that he said there were six available. The man frowned and told me that he would look for Todd. After 10 minutes of waiting, we went in search of this man and while we were wandering the dealership a different Diehl employee approached us and asked if he could help. We told him what we were there for and once again we got told that they did not have a Prius to test drive. He also told us that Todd had gone home for the day. I believe this man was the sales manager, Brandon Znosko. I once again relayed what Todd had told me, and miraculously, Todd appeared a few minutes later. Todd introduced himself to us and then immediately followed this up by telling us, You have me for fifteen minutes because Im going to the hockey game in Detroit tonight.? Apparently this was more important than providing any type of customer service. He then hurriedly took us to the suddenly existent Prius collection on the side lot and we took one for a rushed test drive. During the entire experience it was obvious that he had no interest in selling us the car. I then asked Todd if there was another sales person available who could take the time to assist us with our questions and describe the cars features. The answer was No?. He did not apologize and suggest setting up an appointment at a later day, nor did he attempt to set us up with another representative upon our return. Todd also explained that this fleet of Prius cars was technically not part of the inventory and were being used as rentals. But for a 1000 deposit we could hold one until July. So it appears the cars are for sale, but also not for sale. This appears to be a way around some corporate directive asking the dealership to not sell the Prius. At the conclusion, I informed Todd that we were impressed with the car and would probably buy one. But not from Diehl. Additionally, I generally get my Jeep serviced at Diehl Jeep. Not anymore. I was appalled at the level of customer service at Diehl and I cannot believe that any franchise owner or manager would allow this type of behavior from his employees.

Bob of Edmonton, OTHER May 26, 2008

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